Episode 43

Pablo Ruiz-Múzquiz on Kaleidos, Penpot and Taiga


June 6th, 2023

37 mins 30 secs

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About this Episode


Pablo Ruiz-Múzquiz


Memo Esparza | Perrie Ojemeh | Django Skorupa

Show Notes

Hello and welcome to Sustain Open Source Design! The podcast where we talk about sustaining open source with design. Learn how we, as designers, interface with open source in a sustainable way, how we integrate into different communities, and how we as coders, work with other designers. We’re excited to have as our guest, Pablo Ruiz Múzquiz, CEO of Kaleidos, and creator of Penpot and Taiga. Today, Pablo dives into the challenges of leading a creative business in the open source world, focusing on the need for a perfect open source product, an engaged community, and a sustainable business model. He sheds light on the collaborative and contribution-based model at Kaleidos. Also, there’s a conversation about the future of Penpot and its community, and Pablo shares insights about the upcoming Penpot Fest in Barcelona, and he mentions some upcoming features for Penpot. Download this episode now to hear more!

[00:01:36] Pablo tells us how it is to lead a company like Kaleidos.

[00:03:47] He highlights the importance of autonomy and co-ownership within teams.

[00:06:07] Pablo describes the collaborative and contribution-based model at Kaleidos. He touches on the evolution of the company’s culture, strong opinions, relevant consensus, and the continuous process of redefining themselves.

[00:09:18] In regard to challenges he faced building Penpot, Pablo emphasizes not taking shortcuts and staying true to their values, using accessibility as an example. He also tells us they explore the cultural aspects of Kaleidos, the privilege they enjoy in taking risks, and the commitment to their principles and values.

[00:12:21] There’s a conversation on the work that goes into achieving accessibility in Pablo’s design tool, Taiga.

[00:15:00] Memo wonders what’s next for Penpot and Taiga, and Pablo mentions the upcoming Penpot Fest in Barcelona, where open source communities will join forces to discuss the future design and development using open source and open standards. He also talks about the upcoming features for Penpot, as well as the integration of Taiga into Penpot.

[00:20:23] Pablo highlights the significance of versioning and sharing knowledge with the open source mindset.

[00:22:35] Pablo acknowledges the challenges of balancing abundant content and true accessibility and emphasizes the need for powerful design that empowers designers, and he shares what it takes to be a designer.

[00:28:11] He expresses the importance of cracking the relationship between designers and developers to grow the Penpot community organically, with the ultimate goal of having a strong user base and active contributors.


[00:04:17] “When people work together and are generous with their talent and time, great things happen, open source is just one of those implementations.”

[00:09:52] “The toughest thing to do is not taking shortcuts.”

[00:13:19] “This is not an afterthought, this is not a patch, this is part of a better product.”

[00:14:47] “Look for where there are no incentives, and you’ll probably find a better product to build.”

[00:24:07] “Design is where technology meets society.”


  • [00:33:03] Memo’s spotlight is Excalidraw.
  • [00:33:34] Django’s spotlight is the project Open5e.
  • [00:34:46] Peace’s spotlight is OSCAFEST 2023.
  • [00:35:47] Pablo’s spotlight is Svelte.